How to be fluent in spoken English after years of incorrect pronunciation? | General discussion | Forum
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09:58
July 6, 2011
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Hi guys!
I admit it: I've never loved English. It is useful in life, but I don't like it.
I studied it in school and I use it everyday to read blogs, news and more, but I've never used it in a active way. I still do many errors while writing and my spoken level is awful because I've read a lot, really, but always with the incorrect pronunciation of words in my mind.
How can I reset years of incorrect pronunciation and have a new beginning with this language?
I think that starting with a brand new language is really easier, no old errors to amend, so what do you suggest in this case?
It is easy for me to add new vocabulary (the more I read, the more I learn), a little harder writing with good grammar (too lazy to find a topic, but I can use lang-8 to improve this aspect), but what can be the more effective path to spoken fluency?
Something like antimoon method? (hours of passive input by music, tv news, movies etc)
A lot of shadowing? (mimicking while listening)
A mix of them, I suppose, but sometimes I feel I'm looking for a magical ingredient, the Magic Wand of Language acquisition.
Thanks for sharing your tips!
Speaks 
Learning 
14:15
June 19, 2012
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I don't like English either (and it's my native language).
Not to be discouraging, but when I was at the 2010 Second Language Research Forum conference (SLRF -- pronounced "slurf") speaker after speaker took the stage to say that near-native fluency is impossible after the age of 3. So there you go. But they're academics, so who cares what they think? I would embrace rather than fret over having an accent (the French actress Audrey Tautou wouldn't be a star in the US without her lovely accent) and focus on just understanding and being understood. I find movies with subtitles a great help, and I listen to French radio stations over an Internet radio. Hearing (and if possible) speaking with native speakers seemed to be the key for me, rather than language software products, esp. as you already know the language quite well. And I'll bet you don't speak it as badly as you say!
Now, Italian…there's a beautiful language!
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15:07
July 8, 2011
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I think that English's pronunciation is impossible. They've said that sometimes my talking is incomprehensible 
others have said that it's so cute, or nice, but nobody has said that it's good or clear or easy to understand, which are my aims.
Have you an anglophone friend? Maybe the person can correct you and demonstrate the letters and words?
Advanced : 
Intermediate : 
16:51
July 6, 2011
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kuikentje Jar-ptitsa said
[...] good or clear or easy to understand [...] Have you an anglophone friend?
They're also my aims è_é
Maybe I have to try conversations by Skype, but first I need to practice a little alone, only a really close friend can have the patience to correct all my mistakes!
About the Magic Wand of Language Acquisition, I've started reading and listening HH and the Deathly Hallows, read by Stephen Fry, and started shadowing a bit (thanks puclic library, yeah!). I've also The Hunger Games, but the American by Carolyn McCormick is really hard to understand.
American English and British English are really, really two different things -.-
Speaks Learning
16:57
March 2, 2012
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I second William Alexander: making yourself understood is an important goal; trying to hone your accent is secondary.
If you are dead set on improving your accent, there's no better way than actually speaking! The good thing about English is that you don't really need a native speaker to talk to – especially those who are known for speaking English extremely well (Swedes and Dutch to name two). Plus, Skype is there to help you
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17:07
July 6, 2011
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William Alexander said
focus on just understanding and being understood [...] I'll bet you don't speak it as badly as you say! [...] Now, Italian…there's a beautiful language!
I want to be understood but I know I still do bad errors, in English a a mispronunciation literally means to confuse one word with another. I'd like also to record me to better identify my errors.
Italian: the best thing with it (and Spanish, and in same ways also Japanese – think of kana) is that you read what you see, without worring too much.
Speaks Learning
17:24
July 6, 2011
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Tuco said you don't really need a native speaker to talk to – especially those who are known for speaking English extremely well (Swedes and Dutch to name two)
Now I think that what I really want is to speak Standard English, the one teached to foreigners, and be understood all over the world Sometimes is seems a little artificial, not used by real people in UK or US, but at least it could be a good way to be understood
One of my old mistakes was /ɡrɪt/ instead of /ɡreɪt/ for "great". Probably when I say "fluent" I mean only correct
Speaks Learning
19:24
Experienced Language Hacker
August 2, 2011
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Have you taken a look on the basics, I mean the IPA notation? Great Britain has a variety of accents and dialects. There is a nice site with recordings: http://www.bbc.co.uk/voices/recordings/. You may listen and choose which one suits you the best. Listening is the key.
I live in UK for some eight years and I still have the pronunciation I don't like, exactly for the same reason: I tend to mispronounce words I learned to say improperly few years ago. For example I say ton-goo instead of tongue or eixe instead of axe. But they say cowke with oyse (coke with ice) so we are par:P
Native: 
| Fluent: 
| Conversational and learning: | Elementary and beginner: 
I learned also a bit: 
I would like to learn: 
Polska strona języka walijskiego
22:34
June 19, 2012
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To those who listening is the key to fluency or to making oneself understood, I 'm going to respectfully disagree. I listen to French A LOT. The problem is (as I found when I went to France), I'm not hearing the mispronunciations I'm making. So I ended up with a couple of scenes in France last year that could've been right out Return of The Pink Panther, with Inspector Clouseau (Peter Sellers) pulling the r in “room” from somewhere between his larynx and his liver:
Clouseau: Do you have a rgghum?
Clerk: A…“rgghum”?
Clouseau: What?
Clerk: You said, do I have a “rgghum”?
Clouseau [impatiently]: I know perfectly well what I said; I said, do you have a rgghum!
Clerk: You mean, do you have a room.
Clouseau: That is what I have been saying, you fool!
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13:33
June 1, 2012
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There was a Time magazine article in April 2012 about the relative unimportance of a native accent. Reading that article made me less concerned with accent, and more concerned with being understood.
I'm going to suggest Rosetta Stone, which I'm using and finding very effective, despite some poor reviews (including the one on here.) I wrote on here and on my blog that when I was recently in Montréal, I was complimented on my good "international French" pronunciation. (International French is what people in Quebec call "standard French.") I credit a combination of Rosetta Stone and the website Forvo, which I've turned to to help me pronounce new vocabulary I learn outside of Rosetta Stone.
I think maybe the biggest strength of RS is its ability to improve speaking and listening skills. Even though you're already fluent in reading and writing English, I think you could get a lot out of RS. I'm using it for French and I'm at maybe mid-advanced beginner level. I stopped using it for a couple weeks, so I decided to start all over again at the beginning. So, none of what I was studying was new to me – it was all material I had already learned – and I was able to work through it very quickly. To me, refreshing my memory was useful – you probably won't need that since you already know English so well. But, being able to repeat the words was really helpful in honing my pronunciation. What I am trying to say is that even if you don't need to learn the vocabulary and grammar, the program is still really useful for pronunciation. Maybe it would make sense for you to buy one of the more advanced levels, rather than buying all of them and starting at the very beginning. But, having the structure of a program like that might be what you need. You're way ahead of the game in not needing to learn the written language.
People make a lot out of the fact that it's expensive… but I paid $399 USD for all 5 levels on CD in May 2012. That's a LOT less expensive than equivalent classes would cost, and you can go back and go through it as many times as you like, so I don't think the cost should be prohibitive unless you really have no money.
(Please note I don't work for Rosetta Stone and am not being compensated in any way by them! I just like the product.)
American English (Native)
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French (Low Intermediate)
05:04
July 20, 2012
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William Alexander said speaker after speaker took the stage to say that near-native fluency is impossible after the age of 3.
Not to be rude, but it's not true My friend was pretty bad at English when she was 16 and after 6 years of living in Australia none can tell that she's not a native speaker. So I think it depends on practice and… ear. Spoken language is like music.
08:39
November 22, 2011
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Spoken language is like music.
Exactly! I think I pretty improved my spoken English by simply paying attention when an English song was on the radio. Nothing else.
We both have the same problem because until 2011 I never cared about speaking well; or, at least, I just never thought about it.
The problem we have lays in out Nation (Italy) because English is taught badly and we're pretty ignorant… An average student could never comprehend a conversation in English! It will be our task to improve Statistics =)
Since we have the same problem, the way I'm improving my spoken English may be useful to you. Here's what I'm doing:
- I listen to English music, trying to catch every sound. If I don't understand the lyrics, I search it on the Internet.
- I usually watch YouTube videos in which people talk about various topics (from make-up to the News)
- I read, and when I see a new word I search on the Internet the right pronounciation.
Ok, these are the tips that everyone would give you, but they really work!
feel free to correct my mistakes,
I will appreciate it!
17:49
June 1, 2012
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I've thought this too, and have now read it in a few places. I think that having a "musical ear" can really help with pronunciation. But, like "perfect pitch," "perfect pronunciation" (native pronunciation in a non-native who learned the language after the so-called critical period) is probably quite rare. I think native fluency with a slight foreign accent which doesn't hinder comprehension is much more common.
But, regarding the "musical ear" theory… I would say that it may also take a certain "ear" to detect very slight foreign accents. I have no known musical ability (have never pursued it) but I'm always the one who, when watching a movie, will insist that a character is not a native English speaker. Other people watching the movie willl say I'm crazy and that the actor has NO foreign accent, but then sure enough, when I look up the actor's bio, I find out he or she is originally from a non-English-speaking country. So, not to say that I'm so great and so skilled and other people are wrong, but I think that it may be the case that when some people think their friends are speaking with a native accent, they're really not. These people might just not detect the very slight nuances of the foreign accent.
I think (and it may have been said before) that fluency and perfect pronunciation are two different things. I consider someone who has a strong, say, French accent, but perfect or near-perfect grammar and world choice in English to be completely fluent. Fluency to me has to do with being able to communicate easily… understanding others and being able to be understood by others with ease.
American English (Native)
Learning: French (Low Intermediate)
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