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13:07
May 14, 2012
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Hi guys, I've decided to outline my Spanish language challenge. I'm currently living in Chile teaching English but my Spanish, though it has improved since I got here (three months ago), is still really very basic.
Before I came to Chile, I had just finished the complete Pimsleurs and I was rudely awakened to the fact that it couldn't help me much beyond asking for directions and ordering food and even then I couldn't understand the response! I really think Pimsleurs is a bit of a scam. I really thought after three months with their mp3s I was going to be at an advanced level!!!
In the intervening three months I've done language exchanges and finished a beginner level book. But I feel like after three months I should be a lot better. I get stuck all the time trying to say even easy things, for example yesterday I wanted to say "he already gave it to me" but instead my brain seized up and eventually I said "ya lo di". I think it should be "ya lo me dio" pero no sé.
My language mission is (by October 22nd) to be able to
- Speak fluent Chilean Spanish
- Be able to watch Spanish films without subtitles
- To be able to read one hundred years of solitude without much difficulty
The steps I am taking are as follows.
- Grammar units from Practice Makes Perfect: Complete Spanish Grammar
- Using learning with texts to develop my reading skills (currently reading los cuentos Grimm)
- Using lang-8 to keep a diary to develop my writing skills
- Watching 50 Spanish films with Spanish subtitles (and a notepad)
- Developing conversation using language exchanges
- Keeping a log here of my progress, deciding what's working (and what isn't) and setting new challenges
- Using Anki with the following decks
- A deck of 8,000 vocabulary words ordered by frequency
- A deck (exported from lwt) of new vocabulary encountered during reading
- A deck full of sentence corrections from my writing
- A deck with chilenismos
- A deck with the 100 most popular verbs conjugated in each tense
- And lastly, a deck with conversational connectors
Haha, I think *maybe* I use Anki a little too much. But I'm still thinking of adding an extra one for grammar. I've fallen behind with Anki (I haven't looked at it in over a week), so everything has piled up. Like point number 7 says, I'm going to write a post every Sunday (in Spanish) reviewing my week and setting new challenges. Any comments/criticisms/suggestions are very welcome.
This is a bit of a dour post. So, my goal before next Sunday is to spend three and a half hours each day on 1, 2, 3 and 7 from the above list. And to watch a film every night. Right now things are a bit busy at work so I don't have time for language exchanges but I expect to be able to resume those in a couple of weeks.
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
16:30
Experienced Language Hacker
July 9, 2011
Online
Hi there! First of all, welcome aboard. Like you, I am an avid learner of Spanish, but unfortunately I don't have the advantage of living in a Spanish speaking country. Just talking with Chileans should help you immensely. I have to agree with you on Pimsleur. It's certainly not magic and it's not going to teach you the subtle nuances of the language. Unfortunately, I find this to be true for just about any language program that doesn't offer some sort of live feedback. Language exchanges are a great way to learn, and I personally find watching movies, reading books, and writing a Spanish blog are the best ways for me to progress.
So, you were close. You should have said (El) Ya me lo dió. (He gave it to me.) From what I know, and I may be wrong, the person always comes before the object, so you would never say Lo me dió. Just remember, people come first. I tend to run into the same confusion if I am nervous or in a hurry. The other day I said to someone, Me puedes ayudar? (Can you help me) instead of Te puedo ayudar? (Can I help you) Obviously that can cause a problem. Stuff like that is easily overcome so you shouldn't worry too much about that.
Based solely on my own "missions" from the past, I think you may be trying to tackle too much at once, but it seems to have the right idea. I think you should definitely watch movies, read, and write as much as possible, but take it slow. For example, I have been trying to read Cien Años de Soledad for a long time now, but because it is somewhat antiquated language, I struggle with it, while more current books I find to be less stressful. I would recommend kids books (Harry Potter and Hunger Games are a few I tried and did pretty well with) to start with and work your way to more complex texts. Also, there are countless movies in Spanish, but I find I do better with American movies with Spanish dubbing. Many times I am familiar with the English line, so when I hear it in Spanish it instantly clicks. Don't be afraid of Spanish language movies, but again, try to find simple movies that aren't going to have complex language, especially if your goal is to simply speak conversationally. (You're not writing college essays or anything, right?)
My favorite thing to do, and my current Spanish mission, is to write something daily in my Spanish blog. Feel free to check it out if you like. The link should be in my signature. This helps me learn how to say things I want to say, not just repeat what I hear on the television and it helps reinforce the things I study, as I often use words and phrases I have learned recently in what I am writing. Which brings me to Anki. I study (and add to) my Anki deck everyday, however I fear using as many decks as you suggest you will use might overload your brain. I am not sure how many new words and phrases the brain can actually remember on a daily basis, but you might end up giving yourself more headaches than it's worth.
Again, you have a tremendous advantage by being in Chile. Good luck and please don't hesitate to send me messages here or on my blog. I'm always happy to respond in English or Spanish. Buena suerte!
Learning: Spanish
Wants to add: Portuguese
If you´re bored and want to follow my progress, check out: http://jaimito424.wordpress.com/
17:17
May 14, 2012
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Gracias señor! Quizás intento hacer demasiado pero voy a ver despues de una semana. No quiero leer Cien Años de Soledad ahora pero entreno yo mismo tener la abilidad leerlo en Octubre. Ahora leyo Los Cuentos Grimm (ya he leido El Principito). Despues tengo más libros para estudiar. Tienes razón con las películas. Voy a buscar unos programas españoles de niños (no me gusta los doblados). Pero una problema que yo tengo es que no hay muchos subtítulos en línea. Es fácil encontrar subtítulos inglés pero no tan fácil los españoles. Tienes consejo?!
Translation: Thanks man. Maybe I'm trying too much but I can review after a week. I want to be able to read one hundred years of solitude (or other books of that ilk) after three months – to that end I'm starting slowly with Grimm fairytales and then I'll move on to some more difficult books that I have. It might be slightly unrealistic but I'm going to try anyways… I think maybe you're right about the films – I should take the same approach, I'm going to look for good Spanish kids TV shows. The only problem I find is that it's really easy to get English subtitles online but trying to find Spanish ones usually ends in failure. Any advice?!
P.D Leí tu blog, escribes muy bueno! Y puedo comprender el mejor! Esta hace mi emocionado! Estoy acuerdo contigo que los malos y los buenos no estan tan fácil identificar como se dijeron cuando estaba joven. Yo pensaba que el ley y las policias erán para protegernos pero ahora realizo que no es tan sencillo que eso.
P.S. I read your blog, you write very well. I understood most of it which makes me excited… I agree with how things change when you grow older, the perception of the police for example. I used to think that the police were there to protect us, but it's not a straightforward as that. Well of course they protect, but there are many abuses of this power and they often play the role of state-sponsored enforcers. OK. And thanks for the advice on "ya me lo dió". I find this particularly difficult, I should work on it. Is it an example of a double object pronoun?
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
17:50
Experienced Language Hacker
July 9, 2011
Online
Hola de nuevo! No sé si tienes Amazon.com allá en chile, pero he encontrado muchas películas disponible en español y con subtitulos en español tambien. Busque algo como Y Tu Mamá Tambien (una pelicula bien conocida en español) y estoy seguro que tu recibiras más recomendaciones de peliculas en español. Normalmente no cuestan mucho y el diálogo no es muy difícil entender. Hay un montón de opciones.
Gracias por sus comentarios sobre el blog. Trato de escribir todos los días para mejorarme. De hecho, yo escribo mejor que yo hablo, pero estoy cada vez mejor.
No dude en mandarme mensajes si tienes algunas preguntas. Otra vez, buena suerte.
James
Learning: Spanish
Wants to add: Portuguese
If you´re bored and want to follow my progress, check out: http://jaimito424.wordpress.com/
21:27
July 5, 2011
Offline
Hola! Buena suerte con el español chileno! Mi madre viene de chile, pero yo nací en Canadá. A mí me encanta el español chileno.
19:18
May 14, 2012
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Aiaiai! Esto es mi tercera vez escribirlo! Que lata. Así que, gracias raja50 para tu estímulo. Aquí yo escribiré mi cuenta de la semana.
Comencé bueno y lunes martes y miercoles junté o casi junté mis objetivos. Los otros días fueron malos. Y entonces, no puedo criticar el metodo de mi aprender, solo mi actitud. Para la proxima semana, haré los seguidos:
- Haré unidades de mi libro (una hora y media cada día)
- Escribiré doscientos palabras en lang-8 cada día
- Gastaré media hora cada día leyendo (los cuentos de grimm)
- Miraré capítulos de juego de tronos y desu noto (ambos hablado y subtítulado en español)
- Repasaré todos en Anki para media hora (mas o menos) cada día
- Porque no tengo tiempo para intercambios esta semana, voy a hacer un negocio con mis alumnos que si ellos hablan inglés todo la clase, yo hablaré español durante la pausa.
- Imprimiré una página con estos objetivos para mantener un seguimiento de progreso. Debería ayudarme con mi actitud. Si yo lograré los objetivos tomaré una día gratis el proximo domingo.
Criticísmos y observaciones son bienvenidos! Espero que puedes entender que quiero decir! Disculpe si no hace sentido.
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
20:18
May 14, 2012
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La cuenta por la fin de semana: el domingo, el cinco de agosto. Esta semana era buena. Más o menos, alcanzé mís metas cada día. Eso que no hice, recuperé hoy. Así que vi la primera temporada de juego de tronos (y varios capítulos de Death Note) doblado y subtítulado.
Ahoramismo voy a hacer la decision que una de las debilidades con mi propuesta es que tengo demasiado mazos* en anki. Por esta semana voy a eliminar algunos. Empezaré con el mazo de vocabulario con ocho mil palabras. Creo que la utilidad de eso es muy limitada por que estuve intentando aprender las palabras sin contexto y encontré que yo utilizaría las muy raramente. Entonces eso fue el primero eliminado. La segunda es el con los chilenismos. La tercera es el mazo con conectores de conversación. Encontré eso muy aburrido y nunca los utilicé.
La cosa buena de esos es que puedo reiniciar cualquiera cuando quiero. Tal vez regresaré al mazo de los conectores de conversación. Pero encontré que ahora son demasiado avanzado para mi. No utilizo los en inglés así que no sé si son ideas buenos en español. Quizás más tarde.
Entonces, creo que es mejor si yo aprendo palabras nuevas en contexto (estuve demasiado flojo antés). Mi plan es que voy a anotar todos en libro pequeño. Entonces esta semana:
- Estudiaré un unidad de gramática cada día
- Escribiré doscientos palabras cada díá en lang-8
- Leeré una historia de El Cuento Hispanoamericano cada día
- Miraré la segunda temporada de Juego de Tronos y más de Death Note
- Utilizaré anki por a) los conjugaciones de los cien verbos más populares, b)vocabulario en contexto y c)correciones de los errores que hago en mis composiciones
- Mantendré una libro con vocabulario nuevo
- Intentaré hablar más con mis estudiantes durantes las pausas
*decks
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
22:51
May 14, 2012
Offline
I've decided to start writing this in English again. So last week went okayish. I started reading a book that turned out to be too advanced, so, thanks to jwood424, I started reading Hunger Games in Spanish instead. And the rest was more or less achieved. I need to be a bit more dedicated, I always have work left over for Sunday.
I'm going to
- continue reading (one hour per day)
- and writing (200 words at lang-8)
- another grammar unit
- my anki decks with conjugations, vocabulary and corrections.
- watch Game of Thrones, Death Note and House (dubbed and subtitled in Spanish)
- in addition to this I'm going to do four hours of Spanish language exchange this week (at least)
Any new suggestions would be appreciated.
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
22:35
May 14, 2012
Offline
My 4th week was a complete write-off. I found that I'd given myself too much to do and it was a complete deterrent. To get motivated again I've planned my fifth week as so:
Monday:Study* first and then watch Pan's Labyrinth with Spanish subtitles. I need to do this in the late morning to afternoon. Then I'm doing a language exchange chat in the afternoon and then in the evening I'm going to a barbeque with my former students. They're beginners so I'll get to practice my Spanish as much as possible. And note Chilenismos as I go.
Tuesday:Study in the morning and in the afternoon I'm going to meet someone for a language exchange. Then after work I'm going to watch Amores Perros (can't find good subtitles in Spanish so I'm just going to watch it and try to understand as much as possible (it's unlikely to be very much but I think I'll be able to follow the story)).
Wednesday:Study in the morning. Then after class I'll go to a couchsurfer's meeting and practice more Spanish.
Thursday: Study in the morning. Language exchange in the afternoon. Watch Todo Sobre Mi Madre after work.
Friday:Study in the morning. Language exchange in the afternoon. Watch El Ángel Exterminador(sin subtitulos).
Saturday:Play a five-a-side after work (una pichanga) with people I don't know so practice my Spanish that way. Study and watch Mujeres al bordo de ataque nervios.
Sunday:Watch El secreto de sus ojos.
*When I say study I mean anki, a unit of the grammar book, write 100 words and read a chapter of The Hunger Games.
I've reduced the amount of anki, writing and reading to make it more manageable. I think realistically out of the above, I might read more but I'm giving myself this modest target because how poorly I did last week.
On top of all this I'm going to talk with my landlord at least once a day and with the caretaker at work who has taken an interest in my language studies! He was helping me with the subjunctive last week.
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
12:00
August 18, 2012
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Sounds like a great plan. I have to say, I'm really jealous that you are learning the language while living in a Spanish speaking country. Bueno suerte!
Learning: 
Aspiring: 
00:59
May 14, 2012
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So last week I only achieved about half of what I wanted to do. That's pretty bad, I need to organise my time better. This week I'm going to set myself the same goals. I thought I was half-way through my challenge but I actually gave myself 14 weeks!!! I've just finished week 6.
The only change I'd like to make this week is to use a Spanish learner's dictionary instead of an English-Spanish one. I've read a few times that the sooner you use this, the better (instead of translating everything). I don't think I'm quite at that level yet but I'm gonna try to do it anyway. Can anyone recommend an online Spanish learner's dictionary?
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
15:11
May 14, 2012
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So last week was another failure. So using the tip from Benny's email today I'm going to start logging my progress, like actually giving myself a score out of 6 for the previous week.
Grammar unit 0/6 egad!
Anki 0/6 jesus!
Films 4/6 too easy!
Writing 3/6 OKish
Reading 3/6 blaah.
Speaking 2/6 Ohnooo, I'm only fooling myself.
That's really terrible. I still haven't found an online Spanish learner's dictionary which makes me think it doesn't exist. I'm going to start using wordreference in Spanish which isn't ideal.
I'm half-way through my mission. The last couple of weeks have been a joke. No excuses. New month. Got to get on it. I want a 7 across the board. I want to continue as I am with a new goal of speaking on italki for language exchanges, because, even though I'm living in Chile, I'm not getting as much exposure to the language as I would like.
I'd like to thank Benny for the newsletter, I think it'll help. No, I know it will help. My goals are specific enough. They're achievable. It's just a matter of application. I WON'T BE LAZY!
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
21:21
moderator
July 15, 2011
Offline
To start try finding a Chilean dictionary. My first few months living in Medellín Colombia I bought an urban dictionary with words used in the slums and on the streets of Medellín and it helped me a lot with the local vernacular as well as getting along in the barrios on the outskirts of town. I'm sure that there is something similar for where you live. If not, I'm sure that the Chileans in your city would pridefully teach you their slang and expressions.
Chilean Spanish is unlike any other dialect of Spanish, it's very distinct and unique and maybe that is why you're having some trouble at this time. Think about it, to the north is the Atacama, to the south is Antarctica, to the west is the Pacific and to the east are the towering Andes; Chilean Spanish has had little influence from outside sources for quite sometime and has developed into it's own rich variation of Spanish.
In Colombia when we watch Chilean programs on tv they have subtitles so that the Colombian viewers can understand the dialogue. Crazy no?
My point is not to discourage you. My point is for you to embrace the uniqueness of Chilean Spanish and learn from those around you. Chileans are friendly people and would love to teach you their variation of Spanish, I guarantee it. Enjoy yourself and live Chilean, go where Chileans go, and hang out like they do. Slumped over a desk reading all day won't do the trick, getting out of the house to shake hands make friends is the way to achieve fluency efficiently and quickly.
Learning to fluency:
There will definitely be more that follow!
21:42
May 14, 2012
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I know what you mean but… At weekend, for example, I went to a birthday party with only Chileans (no English speakers). They were really friendly and nice and everything but people were losing interest in talking to me because my level was so low. And I could follow the conversation some of the time but I couldn't contribute because I'm too slow. I see what you're saying but… It ain't that easy getting out of you comfort zone and asking questions but not understanding the answers, I can tell it's exhausting for the speaker as well.
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
12:03
moderator
July 15, 2011
Offline
I see what you mean but what if you're the only one that feels that way? What if you're the one that's uncomfortable and therefore make them feel the same way? I've never met you and know nothing about you but sometimes this a very common sentiment in language learning. Language barriers don't (always) have to be uncomfortable situations. Your personality can shine through your language difficulties. I can tell a genuine, confident, great individual even if we don't share a common tongue. Just have fun and continue getting out there to meet people, it's part of the game. If you ask a question and you don't understand the answer just smile and explain that you are still learning, laugh it off and let them know that you appreciate that they are taking the time to listen to your Spanish.
By the way, what are your hobbies? What do you like to do in your spare time while at home? Whatever your answer might be find people with those interests and hobbies, the only difference is that most of them will be Chilean. I learned a lot of Spanish hanging around people with similar passions because without saying a word we already knew that we enjoyed similar activities and past-times; that my friend is the perfect ice breaker.
Benny has so much advice on the blog if you dig deep enough regarding social situations and I suggest you check them out because I believe his advice works for most people. I have to go to work but I'll put some links on here hopefully tonight.
Buena suerte!
Learning to fluency:
There will definitely be more that follow!
22:48
May 14, 2012
Offline
I appreciate what you're saying and thanks for the advice. I'm gonna start playing in a pichanga (Chilenismo for 5-a-side soccer) to augment what I'm already doing. I feel like socializing in Spanish is beyond me but I guess the best thing I can do is stick it out. I think when I try to say anything people can see my mental anguish which is quite distracting and off-putting. I like the idea of italki because, though I've done quite a lot of language exchanges in person, I found coordinating schedules to be a huge problem and also my partners weren't as dedicated (for want of a better word) as I was. Or else they just found it boring.
The week after next is Chilean independence week so I'm not sure if I'll study at all, I think I'll just take the week off and the city can be my classroom.
Log for last week:
Grammar 3/7, Anki 6/7, Films & TV 7/7, Writing 1/7, Reading 5/7, Speaking 1ish/7
I'm going to continue with my existing challenges, despite the fact that I've performed poorly for 3 weeks or so. I'm gonna prioritise speaking however. I'm desperate to finish this book as well so that's a goal before Friday. I'm also going to prioritise this grammar because I've only 6 units left and I'd ideally like to finish it before next week too, I'm getting sick of it. So in order of priority: 1. Speaking 2. Reading 3. Grammar 4. Anki 5. Writing 6. Films & TV
I find the films and TV to be such an easy thing to do for me, I watched Game of Thrones (I'm not going to watch this any more, I don't like watching dubbed shows) but some really top quality Spanish films as well. Y tu mama también was a highlight I think.
Beagán:
Aprendiendo actualmente.:
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